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Didn't think they were lethal..
  • I want to quit wasting foals dangit! I have two horses that have light and minimal white factor.. the stallion having only frame.. do frame and frame together always equal lethal? I had thought I'd bred some before and been fine.. but I've had a few foals die now and I feel like I still don't have the hang of preventing it..
    the mare has frame and w20.. I looked at the chart, but I forgot to look at frame on the stallion before I bred them.. no frame and frame, ever? Ugh..
    I don't know why genes can't fit in my head! Sadness!

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    BreakingBoundaries BaFrBr



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    Sweet Tea BaSFBr TxT
    Breeder of Quality Warmbloods and Show Horses
    Lover of Brindles, Blacks, Buckskins, Blue Roan's, Bays, Grey's and SABLES! And addicted to Ice, Pearl and the color Purple.. :P
    #28600
  • You can get a non lethal foal :)
    So long as the foal gets no copies of frame or only 1 copy :D
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    Snowflake~KP~Mushroom~&More
    ●▬▬▬▬▬▬๑۩۩๑▬▬▬▬▬▬▬●
    ......»»—————❶❽❻❹⓿—————««......
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    Thanked by 1KAMRanch
  • So will these guys have a chance of a lethal foal?

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    State of Slate BRSp


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    Old Blue BluRoSp

    Breeder of Quality Warmbloods and Show Horses
    Lover of Brindles, Blacks, Buckskins, Blue Roan's, Bays, Grey's and SABLES! And addicted to Ice, Pearl and the color Purple.. :P
    #28600
  • Het Frame x Het Frame = 1/4 chance Lethal Hom Frame foal, 2/4 chance Het Frame Foal, 1/4 chance no Frame foal.
    Thanked by 1KAMRanch
  • Roan and W20 are both pretty safe kit patterns. Even if the foal gets Hom Splash you’re probably going to be ok. I’d say minimal risk.
    Thanked by 1KAMRanch
  • If a foal gets two frame genes it will always die, no matter what the white factor is.

    The other KIT gene combinations are more dependent on how much white you actually get, but crosses like W1 x W1 pretty much always have too much white if foal gets both W1 genes
  • So then, the bays will always have a 1/4 chance of a lethal foal?
    Breeder of Quality Warmbloods and Show Horses
    Lover of Brindles, Blacks, Buckskins, Blue Roan's, Bays, Grey's and SABLES! And addicted to Ice, Pearl and the color Purple.. :P
    #28600
  • Here it is in simple terms horses with the frame gene on the first O example O/wO can't be bred with O/wO but they can be bred with a horse with the frame gene on the second O example OO/w
    The pair you bred will always be lethal together.

    These 2 will be lethal together
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    3G BlackSetter NX
    EE aa CC dd gg Ff SstyS pp zZ SpSps OlwO NxN WF: Light
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    3G Draygo Thief X
    EE aa CC dd gg ff SstyS pP KitmKit SpsSps OlwO WF: Large

    These 2 will be fine even though both have frame its on a different allele
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    3G BlackSetter NX
    EE aa CC dd gg Ff SstyS pp zZ SpSps OlwO NxN WF: Light
    image
    3G Blue Spirit
    eE Ata CC dd gg ff SSsty PP KittoKitw SpSps OOlw WF: Large
    Thanked by 1KAMRanch
  • @Wolfgang the placing of the genes, eg Ee only stands for who the horse got it from. I cant remember if it's mother/father or father/mother, but a horse will always pass on one of the two and it's a coin toss as to which one they pass on. In terms of breeding, O/Olw and Olw/O are the exact same and will result in the same foal.

    You will ALWAYS have a 1/4 chance of a lethal foal when breeding two het frame horses together.
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
    Prices are almost always negotiable.
    Thanked by 1KAMRanch
  • And please remember Freaky Friday’s are homozygous Frame if they haven’t been GMTd to remove it! All of their foals will carry Frame, and breeding them to another Freaky Friday will always give you a Lethal Foal. Yes, I’ve made this error. It HURTS.
  • Oh man.. I totally would have done that.. now I won't. Lol thank you so much Cheers!
    Breeder of Quality Warmbloods and Show Horses
    Lover of Brindles, Blacks, Buckskins, Blue Roan's, Bays, Grey's and SABLES! And addicted to Ice, Pearl and the color Purple.. :P
    #28600

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