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Why did this colt get gelded? - Horse Genetics Game - Dev Forum
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Why did this colt get gelded?
  • Why did this foal get gelded? He is better then sire image
    Magic Orpheus
  • My guess would be he's probably not better than his mother then. Remember, this new testing takes into account both parents now,
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
    Prices are almost always negotiable.
  • His PT may be higher than his sire, but that doesn't tell you anything about where in the range of possibilities his breeding ability falls. Also the new breeding advice tests against both sire and dam. It looks like his dam is likely a very high blue (since his PT is well above the sire's AFPT). Your colt is probably a low A, so was gelded.
    I was jllewis on the old forum.

    Stable ID 88
    Thanked by 2Ammit SquirrelFarms
  • Kiss is from a high quality boosted line. You will need to pick top stallions if it's taking both parents into account now.
  • I agree with Ondowa in the reasoning as to why he was gelded. I think his sire was a 'low' A, and his PT and AFPT is below what the dams was. I would consider crossing your mare with stallions that have AFPT's around 11.2 or over.

    I know PT does not have a correlation with breeding ability, but AFPT does show where a mare/stallion may be sitting - whether she be a 'high' or 'low' of that particular paper level.

    For example, these two boys are G4 A's, PT's are 11.6 and 11.3 (Their AFPT is respectively 11.2 and 11.4). I breed them with mares with an equivalent paper level and AFPT's that are similar to or match the stallions AFPT. This season I have not yet got a snipped foal from using this method.

    PT 11.6/ AFPT 11.2
    image
    IV Belle Isle


    PT 11.3/ AFPT 11.4
    image
    IV Exclusively Mine


    I got this intact filly from pairing Belle Isle with a mare who was Blue (PT 11.6). Her dam hadn't yet had a foal, so an AFPT was not available - I decided to breed them together as they had similar (the same!) PT.
    image
    V Enchanted Rose i8


    Also the same scenario with this foal - his dam had not been bred before, so I paired her with my stallion who had a similar PT and was also on the equivalent paper level.
    image
    III Scottish Snow i8
    AztecArabians
    ~ Striving to breed exceptional, affordable Warmbloods ~
    ID 19120
  • sadly I cant look at your horses Aztec but thanks for helping me out everyone :) and @Cheers do you have a stud that would go good with Kiss? with pearl satin or sooty+ ?
  • and whats up with this foal getting altered the parents paper and AFPT were the same I'm getting so frustrated!image
    Irish Blitz
  • There is a random factor involved with every combination. Just like in real life, you cannot guarantee that every foal is going to be a winner or a super breeding horse. Even if you bred American Pharoah to Zenyatta 6 times you might get one foal who is a superstar and 5 others that barely make it to the track. One of those 5 foals might be a great sire or dam, but the superstar foal might not make babies that are worth anything. You use what knowledge you have to tip the odds in your favor, but it doesn't always work.

    You are not doing anything wrong! Don't get too frustrated!
    image
  • There's an old post from the old forum explaining some of the reasons.

    Take two perfect foundations. They will have 100% breeding ability (the best for regular foundations) and a PT score of 9.9.

    When they are bred together, each of them will contribute to the foal's PT score from a fairly wide range of possibilities

    If the contribution from both parents comes from the top of the range, the foal will have a fairly high PT score. If both contributions come from the low end, the foal will have a low PT score. If one contribution is low and the other high, the foal will have a mid-range PT score.

    This explanation is about PT score inheritance because there are lots of known numbers to help make it clear. The same sort of thing is going on with the inheritance of breeding ability, so that it is fairly common to get foals that get neutered along the way because they don't measure up to their parents.
    De gustibus non disputandum. "There's no arguing about tastes."

    SandyCreek Farm: ID# 441
    also playing H&J1 as SandyCreek Acres: ID# 137592
  • Here is another visual, that may help (Start from the bottom):

    image
    image
    Thanked by 2Ritsika supersarah
  • I understand that but its still very frustrating because I'm spending a ton of money on horses that are getting altered its driving me crazy. I'm not having very much fun I'm taking the advice I have been given but horses are still getting altered I loose either way
  • Imagine the frustration at the level of breeding real horses! Top breeders can spend thousands of dollars and years of planning only to find mother nature (and the deities of probability) have other things in mind. I don't think any breeding program can have 100% success.

    I can definitely understand how you'd be frustrated, though, if getting intact foals is what makes the game fun for you. For me, the fun is in the chance of it. Maybe I'm a closet gambler. I'd find it far less fun if I was successful every single time.
    Thanked by 1SquirrelFarms
  • Just about everyone is getting lots of altered foals. Its not just you.
    Its how the game is now. I mean its always been a gamble but now its much harder to get intact offspring. Even when doing as much as you can to match up parents. I know its frustrating but youre not going to get an intact foal every time. I dont even think Im getting intact foals half the time. But if you dont like how the game works then maybe find a different one that suits your needs better. From what ive seen youre getting a decent amount of intact foals
    Thanked by 1Coeur
  • A follow up to what Waldgraf said, my mum spent a bucket load of money buying a dog in Iceland and shipping it all the way to NZ. On the way she actually thought it may have gotten lost! (In like England or something). When the dog got to Australia and the breeder there that my mum works with, it turns out this dog has an open fontanelle, meaning one bump on the head could kill it. So it's not going to go to NZ. It's been a few years since then and this dog hasn't gone into season, meaning it can't be bred from....

    I learned my lesson from this that breeding isn't fun....I'm just happy about the colour combos that I get!
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
    Prices are almost always negotiable.
  • Even a perfectly pair breeding only has about a 50% chance of being intact. You bred 41 horses that I can see and 15 are intact. That's not a bad ratio. It is a little low, but a few bad pairings and poor luck with the random numbers could easily account for those numbers.

    That is kind of why I told you last month to forget these one off higher gen pairings and start your own line. You would be happier if you focused your efforts on breeding some nice solid foundation mares, and forget the fancy colors for now, you have two very nice studs who will inject some fancy into your lines later on. You would get more intact horses and have more fun.

    Sell these higher gen horses, use the money to build your foundation lines, or get used to seeing a lot of culled horses. Your mares are all over the place quality wise and you don't have the right studs for them. Build your own lines, you will get to know them better and get to know who pairs well with who.
  • SandycreekFarm's explanation is not correct. There is no double random factor. Unfortunately I can't make heads of tails of that image CF posted. I don't know what it is representing.
  • Thanks, Ammit.

    I have taken out the reference to random elements. If I'm still seriously wrong I will remove the post.
    De gustibus non disputandum. "There's no arguing about tastes."

    SandyCreek Farm: ID# 441
    also playing H&J1 as SandyCreek Acres: ID# 137592
  • When they are bred together, each of them will contribute a number to the foal's PT score that will range from 8.9 to 10.4. The average of these numbers will be the foal's PT score.



    This is the incorrect line. :)
  • Thank you.
    De gustibus non disputandum. "There's no arguing about tastes."

    SandyCreek Farm: ID# 441
    also playing H&J1 as SandyCreek Acres: ID# 137592

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