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Help with Varnish
  • I know this should maybe be in the Genetics section but I wanted as many people to see it as possible. The Appaloosa chat seems as stumped as I am!

    I want to get varnish out of my lines, and to do that I have to understand it. First, I'm assuming it is heritable, and not a (hugely common) mutation like brindle.

    So now I need to know if it is recessive (needing 2 copies to be expressed) or dominant (needing only 1 copy) or if it is on something of a spectrum like DP; 2 copies will give you more dramatic/earlier varnishing but 1 copy will still cause varnish, just to a lesser degree.

    It's also complicated by the fact that varnish doesn't always show up right away. However I think all of my appies with varnish have started showing at least a little by 5 or 6.

    I'm also assuming that non-appaloosa horses can also carry varnish, the same as they can carry snowflake and ECA3P - it just won't be visible. This is my only conclusion based on the fact that my non-varnish appy stud, when bred to solid mares, has thrown some varnish appy babies.

    So here's my liver app stud. He's 5 and doesn't have a fleck of varnish. I've used him for just one season so far so I don't have much of a sample size for foals yet (and won't for a few seasons, since it takes a couple 'years' for the varnish to show).
    image
    AH3 To The Moon


    Most of his appy foals are now 3 years old and some are clearly showing varnish, some aren't. Depending on how the gene behaves, I can assume my stud has either one or zero copies of varnish. Does anybody have any more info on this gene and how it acts on phenotype?
  • I think it has something to do with Llp.(?)
  • I don't think so. LP is just the gene for Appaloosa and is separate from pattern (ECA3P or snowflake) and varnish. Appaloosas can be homozygous or heterozygous for LP and it doesn't have an effect on whether or not they varnish. At least not that I've seen.
  • I think it's a combination of genes and it's probably a more advanced script than we know of. I know that horses who are het snowflake are also more likely to show heavier varnishing when they're younger.

    I'm pretty sure my snowflake boy's kids all have varnishing, which could either mean that it's a build up of genes like DP with the het snowflake and appaloosa, or varnishing could potentially be dominant?
    #4519
  • In the Real World, varnish is associated with Lp without PATN1.

    I have zero clue how it's handled in-game, though.
  • Where is our wonderful goddess game creator to help us lol
  • I'm jumping in on this because I also have no idea which genes are responsible for varnish and snowflake -- and what factors dictate how white varnish apps will get.
    ID# 43830
    |<> Favorite flavors: wild bay, S+, satin, and ice 9. <>|
  • First, I'm assuming it is heritable,

    LP is the gene that causes varnishing but other heritable factors can influence how much it appears. Non appy horses carry those factors as well.

    It is neither hom nor het. It's not simple Mendelian inheritance.

    You can breed for very low varnish by culling out horses that varnish early in life.
    Thanked by 1HTRanch
  • All Lp horses will be varnished eventually, the degree and age is what you'll want to breed for. The best way I think would be to wait until your horses are over ten years old and then breed from the least varnished. It'd be a long term project for sure, but if you breed young and then most of your breeders varnish out at 6-7, you'll have to start over or cull down to just a few. If you already have an established herd, you could easily pull the least varnished horses out for this project.
    #28036
  • You can tell if a horse will varnish much at pretty young age. No need to wait that long.
  • So stupid question. What is varnish? Is it the faint spots that are on the horse on the main post?
  • Varnishing is an effect in appys that "whites out" a coat. It can turn a black horse white. It can also show up spots that weren't there before. Here are some examples of varnish:

    image
    415541


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    SprinklesAtAndaria Adptd


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    KC 450930
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
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