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In this Discussion
- Ammit June 2018
- Bandit1119 June 2018
- Cheers June 2018
- ColorGoodStables June 2018
- JustaSaddletramp June 2018
- kintara June 2018
- Lallyhop June 2018
- pfrsue June 2018
- SandycreekFarm June 2018
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What did I do wrong?
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I found "the perfect" stud for my hidden gates mare. Got this gorgeous baby. Ran BA for some dumb reason, and snip I have a spayed mare
2G HiddenRansom2 -
Without having any other testing done it’s hard to say exactly but most likely the stud is higher quality than the mare and the foal wasn’t high enough compared to him to pass breeding advice.
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I agree with bandit. Site must be a high/mid B and the colt turned out to be a low B----
Barn ID 4953 -
I would suspect the stallion is slightly higher quality than the mare, but it also may simply be that the foal is from the bottom end of both their ranges. It happens. Breeding similar papers to each other never guarantees you foals that pass, it just gives you a better chance of foals that pass. I think the pass rate with perfectly matched horses without pasture bonus is only 50% or so.
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Sorry I had to finish work before I could finish explaining.
There is quite a range within each paper level and it is not uncommon for 2 or 3 generations to compare superior to sire but paper the same.
You are more likely to get an intact foal by breeding even and there’s 2 ways of that- breeding by generations or papers.
I find it easier to breed by generations and then if I have different papers within that generation, group them together, so that the same quality is being bred together (if possible) and it’s easier to gauge what level that horse is within the paper level.
Looking at the foals pedigree I think you may have had a better chance at an intact foal by breeding the mare to the studs sire. Since they are both rank specials you know their quality is the same. The stud doesn’t say that it needs testing so most likely has been run through BA or SBA. It doesn’t have comparison test results recorded but is most likely at least as good as or superior to sire therefore the stud is as good as or superior to the mare.
BA tests the foal against both the dam and sire and to pass it must be at least close to the same quality if not better and SBA requirements are stricter. Since the stud is at or above the mares quality the foal needs to be nearer his quality or better to pass
You may have had a bad roll of the dice and trying again next year may produce an intact foal but I would suggest looking for an expro or rank special foundation stud to breed to your mare. For better results yet stick her in a pasture with the foundation stud so that she gets her full bonus.Thanked by 1SalishSea -
While this topic has come up - do we know percentages for each papering?
I know that PFs are supposed to have 100% breeding ability (C/yellow) and a 1% breeding boost will push them to B/red (correct me if I’m wrong). Is it 101-105% for B/red (thus meaning even a low B given a 5% boost would become an A) or is it different? What percentage does star start at?ISO any and all Silver Pocket Watches!
God grant me the hbs to buy the ponies I need,
The fortitude to resist the shiny ones I truly don't,
And the wisdom to know there will always be more next time. -
A 5% boost will not take a low B to A paper.
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Thank you, Cheers! Do you have any other boosts you’ve applied that you know what they’ll do relative to papering?ISO any and all Silver Pocket Watches!
God grant me the hbs to buy the ponies I need,
The fortitude to resist the shiny ones I truly don't,
And the wisdom to know there will always be more next time. -
All horses, even good ones, don't throw a perfect foal each time. Just got unlucky really and the foal wasn't good enough to pass. Sometimes you get foals worse than parents, sometimes better than parents
An exceptionally perfect is 105%, and a 5% boost takes them to an A paper
No idea what the percentages work out to after that though, but I'd guess that roughly 120% breeding ability would be a Star? There is no way to work that out though once they are past foundation and known breeding abilityThanked by 1Lallyhop -
If possible, you might want to put your mare in the pasture before next month's breeding cycle begins, too. As close to 30 days as you can, to maximize the benefit.
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that the foal is from the bottom end of both their ranges
Not how breeding works.
___________
Need to contact me? Read this first.
http://www.huntandjump.com/forum/discussion/3/how-to-get-help-from-an-administrator -
Ammit, what would be the proper explanation then? I would assume Cheers was referring to the numbers behind the scenes of coding, but maybe not.
I’ve had it explained to me that way too - that each horse has a “range” they can throw, and basically (in simple talk) they each assign numbers to the foal and those numbers are averaged to figure out how good the foal’s secret numbers are, so that in the end the foal might be worse, as good as, or better than the parents.
Is there a better way to put it that’s more accurate?ISO any and all Silver Pocket Watches!
God grant me the hbs to buy the ponies I need,
The fortitude to resist the shiny ones I truly don't,
And the wisdom to know there will always be more next time. -
Yep and I keep telling people that is wrong. :)) Horses do not have a range of what they can produce. Each CROSS has a range it can produce, not each horse. A failed to a star has a different range of what it can produce than a star to a gold.
___________
Need to contact me? Read this first.
http://www.huntandjump.com/forum/discussion/3/how-to-get-help-from-an-administrator -
So, in other words the mare is X and the stallion Y... X+Y always equals Z, but a variable we don't get to see can add or subtract from the total quality of Z.Justa ~ ID# 44842
A chronic sufferer of shiny pony syndrome breeding for DP, Pearl, Brown, Nexus, and Watercolor in Appaloosa, Dun, Sabino 2, and Kit M patterns.
"God grant me the hbs to buy the ponies I need,
The fortitude to resist the shiny ones I truly don't,
And the wisdom to know there will always be more next time." -
Thanks for that clarification, Ammit.De gustibus non disputandum. "There's no arguing about tastes."
SandyCreek Farm: ID# 441
also playing H&J1 as SandyCreek Acres: ID# 137592 -
Thank you! I assume that, in more detail, the cross would also depend on whether or not it was a high or low variant of that paper?ISO any and all Silver Pocket Watches!
God grant me the hbs to buy the ponies I need,
The fortitude to resist the shiny ones I truly don't,
And the wisdom to know there will always be more next time. -
So the mare and stallion each have a set breeding quality/number, and that combined/averaged is what the foal is, plus or minus the breeding random factor? It got me thinking though on what determines that range... So if a yellow mare and a Star stallion breed, the range would be bigger?