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Lethal Baby?
  • Bred This girl one more time before i had her BA tested and the foal died. Says she has been bred this year but only has her last baby in the part where you can see what foals are hers.

    Is this a lethal breeding? If So how?

    This is the mare:
    image
    BWE SC Mare


    This is my stallion:
    image
    G2 Love to be Freaky sell
  • It would be the w2 and the w20 that caused a lethal foal. It's a low risk cross, but I'm guessing the foal also probably got frame, which can increase the white on a horse, thus increasing it's WF ((from what I understand)).

    Here's the chart for you to have a look at. I'd still do the cross in the future myself though.

    http://hj2.huntandjump.com/forum/discussion/13757/new-kit-lethality-and-kit-mutation-load-explained#Item_12
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
    Prices are almost always negotiable.
  • @ObsidianKitsune, How do you know what W the horses have? Is the WF the W?
  • Ok, so this is the genetics of the gray mare you have:

    ee Aa CC dd Gg FF SstyS PP Kitw20Kit WF: Light

    WF stands for White Factor and states how much white a horse will have. It's done by numbers and ranges for 1 upwards, with over 100 being lethal (I think). But to make things easier, we're given a range of what the horse is in ((eg Light, extensive, large, etc))

    The kit genes (kitw20, kitw2, kitr for roan, etc) tend to work on the horse and give patterns. The white ones, with "w" in front of the number (with the exception of white 1, which is just w) dictate which white pattern will be on the horse.

    WF is somewhat inherited. Some genes like frame (Olw) and splash (Sps) will increase the WF of a horse, so a safe cross like two light WF horses could result in a dead foal if one of the parents pass on their splash or frame.

    Some kit genes are lethal with each other to differing degrees. There's actually a chart with numbers, the link to it is below the coloured chart. so while a horse with a WF:Light can survive having kitw20kitw2, like your stallion, a horse with a WF:Extensive would die.

    I hope I explained it well enough...if not, someone else will come around and have a go themselves~
    Producer of Volcanic Glass Drafts. Lapisobsidianus.
    Prices are almost always negotiable.
  • If you look at your horse’s genetic test results you will see the Kit genes towards the right side of the list.

    White spotting kit genes are written w#, so just plain w for W1, and then w2, w3, w8, w20 etc. Your mare is Kitw20 and your stallion is Kitw20 Kitw2.

    The WF is White Factor. It’s the right most part of the genetic testing and will be anything from None to Extensive. The higher a White Factor a horse has, the more it will express its patterning genes (Appaloosa is not affected by white factor and is governed by a whole different set of genes).

    The more white a horse has on its body, the more “broken” it’s genes are. This is why in real life, animals that are white or mostly white are more likely to be deaf, or get certain cancers, or to have other disorders of the way processes and molecules work in their bodies. Many of these sorts of genetic disorders result in the Baby not making it to birth in the first place and instead being stillborn or simply dying in early pregnancy.

    Horses in the game that are mostly white are likely to have a combination of pattern genes and high white Factor that make them risky to breed to. In this case, I think you just got really unlucky, as the foal must have had similar genetics to its sire.

    Unfortunately, luck definitely plays a role in the game and in real life breeding. I would have made this cross without blinking, as it really is a relatively low risk cross. I’m sorry you had bad luck this time.
  • @ObsidianKitsune, That helped quite a bit thank you so much! :)

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